Joining a team in its early stages can be a very ambiguous time. No one’s really telling you what to do—you just make a decision and hope it's right. 🤷♀️
In many cases at a startup, there’s not an established HR or People Ops role yet. So how do you make sure you’re building company culture that connects to your business goals and helps your organization grow?
How do you organically start and maintain meaningful traditions at your company, traditions that will appeal to different personalities and needs?
In this episode of Crafting Culture, I catch up with CADRE’s Culture & Events Manager, Catie Case. Catie is all too familiar with building company culture and pulling it out of (seemingly) thin air—and doing it right.
In our conversation we cover:
Have a listen below, and let us know what beloved traditions your company has on Twitter @getzestful.
Catie Case: It's funny because developing in a role as the companies uh developing like I was kind of forced to grow up over and over and over again and through a lot of that time. I didn't necessarily have someone who was telling me what to do or how to do it.
Announcer: You're listening to Crafting Culture, a podcast dedicated to helping CEOs, people ops, and HR teams create an incredible company culture. If you're looking for inspiration, practical advice, or tangible examples of what great culture looks like then you've come to the right place. Let's get into the show.
Kate Marshall: Hey Kate here. Thanks again for tuning in for another episode. Today I sit down with Catie Case. Catie heads up culture and events at Cadre which is a digital marketplace for commercial real estate headquartered in New York City. Catie was actually the sixth employee at Cadre. Which now has more than a hundred and fifteen employees and as someone who has never stayed at a company longer than two years, I have mad respect for Catie and her perspective on building culture from the ground up. She started as an office manager and now heads up events and culture and really has a good grasp on how to form traditions, how to build culture, and how to let those things happen organically over time. So without further Ado, let's dive right In. Here's Catie.
Thanks so much for hopping on with me today. I'm super super stoked to talk about growth and pick your brain on a couple of things. So thank you.
Catie: Of course, thank you for having me.
Kate: Yeah, so let's start by just having you introduce yourself. Tell us what you do at Cadre and about your company a little bit.
Catie: Sure. So, my name is Catie. I work at Cadre which is headquartered in New York City. Where in SoHo in the Park building, which is an awesome location. I have been with the company for almost five years now that it will be five years in April, and I was hired really early on so I actually started as employee uh number six and I'm actually number for in tenured now. So I've been here for basically the entire time that the company has kind of been operating and obviously through that we've seen we've seen a lot in the last four years. We've seen a lot of growth and have seen a lot of people added to our team which has been an amazing thing um for me to witness and something that I really had a lot of direct contact with uh given my role which has evolved over time. I started more of like a traditional office manager, but also was hired to kind of be starting to think about culture and kind of like what our team and what are what are fiber would look like and it's it's definitely evolved um a bit more into um a culture and events. And now it's um I've also I've also got a lot of office operation and office kind of decor architecture layouts uh planning um really a wide range, um but growing from employing number six and I started to now we're at almost a hundred and fifteen there has been a lot under that that umbrella.
Kate: Sounds like you are never bored.
Catie: No, I'm not and um it's funny because developing in a role as the company’s developing like I was kind of forced to grow up over and over and over again and through a lot of that time, I didn't necessarily have someone who was telling me what to do or how to do it. But that's kind of how I best operate. It’s sink or swim. It's hey, here's a challenge. Here's a problem or here's something you need to figure it out, go do it. So I think it's been an awesome opportunity for me to push myself consistently and um and I definitely wouldn't be where I am today if I was just kind of handed a roadmap.
Kate: Yeah. I love that and I love a visual of grow up because yeah, so us can relate to growing up in a certain role and every role that we go to is a period of growth um and we it like also personifies a company to like a company uh starts as a baby and now you're uh growing and flourishing and walking and talking uh and yeah, I love that. you've been there through that entire thing and love to hear that. You have found that autonomy and have really pursued this role in grown it into into what it is today.
Catie: Yeah, and now I'm just another thing that uh popped into my head you're saying that um we do we've got uh lot of employees that have been at the company for the the same as time periods me but we know we've got a lot of four years or three years. So seeing my fellow colleagues also growing into their roles, you know, some staying in the path that they were hired for, some being able to kind of pivot and find a new, you know, career choice or path that's been equally rewarding for me. And I think that's that kind of goes across the map. You know, it's we've got a lot of people that you know earlier in their career so really seeing people being able to take these big steps in the company. It's something that's it's like I said really rewarding.
Kate: Yeah, and that really speaks to uh the culture that you've been building this whole time, and I'm really curious to know. Can you kind of paint a picture of what the culture was like when you first started as the sixth employee at this company? Was there like we're there any traditions? Was there really a culture, and then how has that grown over time?
Catie: You know that they're there were a few things that were established. I mean two the employees that were at company when I started uh came over then they worked previously at design firm together and then they were at Square together. So, you know, they had some things and things that worked well for them. Um something as simple as putting out, you know. Snacks and like a special beverage on a Friday afternoon or you know doing we would do like a weekly team laundry would do a team a team outing as we add new employee starting. So some of those kind of like smaller traditions definitely existed um one of the reasons that I was higher than what that I was the right personality thick fit for what my CEO and the other leadership team were looking for early on is they really wanted someone that would be kind of a good bind between um tech people and non-tech people, so I didn't even explain what my company does. We have a mix of kind of investment real estate professionals and then more uh traditional tech people so developers and designers. So I'm kind of able to interact and find common interest between both sides. So really early on it was just kind of thing like what can I do that will be exciting for like I said for an engineer but also for someone who is traditionally working in the finance world at Goldman Sachs. A lot of that had to do like I didn't really kind of get to know people kind of like create concepts or ideas that were a little bit unique, um like a little bit niche but then also familiar and then, you know a little bit um just kind of like interesting to say the um least. And I but I kind of learned early on is um even though we're adults people still really love competitions. So I think a lot of my early ideas, right how can I what can I do to make people not to make them to create like an interactive element an activity that we're doing that uh uh will get people away from their computers away from thinking about work and thinking about something that's just so bizarre and that they kind of have to pay attention to.
Kate: And that's something that I've seen a lot because it's you know, even if you're stepping away from your desk, you know, there's all these things out there about oh, it's so simple to just have lunch away from your desk and go to coffee with a colleague, but then you always end up, or at least in my experience, I almost always end up thinking about work or talking about work with the person that I'm with or whatever. It's just kind of inevitable. So yeah, if you are coming up with those things that kind of force you to get you out of that mindset because it's so out of the box or so bizarre. I love the idea of like not forcing but like kind of forcing for you to to uh not think about it for a second.
Catie: Definitely. So I I think um yeah, I think I learned early on that competition was something that piques the interest of my team. And again, it was something that that really excited different levels of the company, different departments of the company, people of different um tenure. So, you know early employees kind of later employees. And so there's a things that we introduced that became really annual traditions that so for and we're in our fifth year now and seeing the level of dedication and excitement and how certain things have evolved over the years. It's something uh I'm super proud of and it's a tradition that I'll dive into whenever ready
Kate: Nice. Yeah, let's hear it.
Catie: Okay. So this was my wild idea. This is my first so I started in April of 2015 and you know, we had done a couple things we did this thing called the spaghetti challenge where everyone's given, you know, 20 pieces of spaghetti and marshmallows. And etc, etc. And that went over well.Iit was fun. But I'm thinking this was in the fall and you know what this something is going to sound so silly but I've always wanted to throw a pumpkin carving contest and I and I never you know, I never done this on my own. I don't know. I'm trying carving plenty of pumpkin growing up. I'm like, I'm gonna do a con as I think I think I probably have been watching a lot of Food Network where they have the crazy part comes uh in carving things. So I Is this to my team? We're probably about 20 or so at the time and I definitely got a lot of blank stares and a lot of kind of like, are you sure that you want to do this? And the first year the first, you know, everything is kind of a trial and error so something that works one your won't work, but the next the first year I heard everyone up into duo's and I was uh like, okay carve a pumpkin either with a Cadre theme with a New York theme or with a spooky scary theme, and you know some of the pumpkins ended up looking not so nice, but then some of them were so artistic and really had a lot of interesting concept in behind them and it was a fun night, you know, like people were wearing aprons. They're being silly, their hands are messy and by the end of the night, we're giving everyone like all the teams are giving presentations. I think I looked around and I noticed like even the people that were kind of naysayers for this contest. They had a lot of fun. So and um I'm someone that loves taking photos and documenting things so and competition the first year it was like, you know got pretty heated. So by the time the second year came around, you know, I'm saying like, of course we're going to the pumpkin carving again. It was so fun. It's obviously it's a pretty low barrier to entry. You really don't need that many supplies and um and really like you can you can gain points or you can you can get in interest from other people that are voting for things other than creating like the most beautiful pumpkin um if he's got a cool narrative or if you've got a cool idea. So for me it's and it's something that necessarily takes, you know, athletic endurance like some other competitions would so um yeah, so, you know the second year we're leading up to it. And so I to get to get new people, you know excited because obviously in a startup you've got 10, 20, 30 new people starting your year over year. So, you know, like I would just start releasing photos from the previous year on slack on email and All Hands meetings to really kind of drive up excitement. So really year after year, the our team has grown the artistic integrity of the pumpkins really it's so impressive and you know, you know, we've got people that are not saying that people have to go out and buy extra supplies or extra materials, but some people will go on and order, you know, a 50 pound pumpkin from New Jersey and bring it in or you know something there's sometimes there's power is involved we have um yet. So it's like they've definitely gotten very crazy. But then sometimes the simple ones actually are the more meaningful ones that end up winning and one thing that's really nice um for a young startup. We actually have a lot of employees with children and we're really welcoming of children at events in the office. But we've got a couple kids that have come to this pumpkin carving year after year. So they'll they’re, you know parent or uh their mother or father will get them involved. So this last year we um have one of our one of our actually early employees name Case guy his daughter Annika uh has come every year for the last four years and she's always involved. But this year he really gave her full artistic direction freedom. And I think last year a pumpkin didn't win and so, you know, she went home after work just like Dad like why doesn't my pumpkin win? Like it'll win one day don't worry. So this year, you know, she's I think she's seven or eight now so she can she can really speak. So she did the presentation this year for their pumpkins, which was very simple there were much more complex pumpkins, but she explained she like this is my this is my pumpkin. It's a kitty. Her name is Sparkle. The entire company lost it, lost it crying, everyone voted for her and you know, like the people that put in the time and effort still had so much time has gone today. She didn't put in time ever people that went out and did these Grand crazy ideas with uh confetti Shooters and all this they still had an amazing time the rest of the company still loved watching them present but it goes to show that you know, like this this one like little human element is what won this year. Yeah. So it just it's just a nice way and I like I said, like there's we've had so many new people start this year. And so we had we had a couple teams of all new people and um they had really cool interesting ideas that we haven't seen in the past. I don't know. It's just I like I said this started it as a really silly thing year one and it's something that through the years has grown has changed has evolved. But the other um the day it's one of the events that it's not related to work. It's not related to, you know, a serious event. It's where we can all just kind of be silly have fun and be creative and still get that competitive element going.
Kate: Yeah. I love well first of all, that is the best thing I've heard all week. Now. I feel like I need to go get a cat named sparkles. Take it to the next pumpkin carving class. I can find. That's so sweet. And yeah, I think we all have like heartfelt traditions that have happened in our lives and when you can tie that into two like a work event that really creates a bond that is irreplaceable. Yeah, um and I love hearing that is how how many people were at your company when you first started that tradition?
Catie: There probably about 20.
Catie: And then you know, we grow In every year but I definitely have a lot of photos from every year. So it's kind of fun to see uh how things have uh evolved and and uh different winners too because sometimes it is again, like I said The more complex pumpkin that's got you know, what is it called? Dry smoke what kind of put ice but then like I said, sometimes it's the more it's this simple, but it's got like a great concept or again like symbol and has a great narrative, but I think that's what it's nice because it kind of keeps people on there. Like which angle do we want to go this year?
Kate: Yeah. That's that's so much fun. Now I want to come can I help uh you?
Catie: Yes, you can. Of um course. I will live streaming next year um another way that that that kind of tradition has evolved is we also encourage um kind of are the working team. So like say the asset management team or the people team like you guys they can dress up in a costume throughout the day. We've always done the pumpkin carving either like randomly. Or you can enter as a certain team or you can enter with your friends, but we encourage the teams to enter or to dress up in costume. So that has uh been like another side note where some the uh teams that may not care as much about pumpkin carving. They'll go all out there with costumes. So it's really kind of blown up into this fun day that different personalities can really shine and show.
Kate: Yeah, that sounds super fun. So well, I would love to hear some examples of things that maybe haven't worked so well over the years now that we that we know that you know, this is like this is that the success that you've seen with this kind of silly event. Can you think of any examples of any traditions that you've started that maybe haven't caught on quite as well and how did you and your team handle that you're over year?
Catie: It's a good question. We've definitely tried a lot I think for us I think like going outside of the office and like massive massive groups that we're In New York City, so it's just not always as easy as if we were say some places bigger venues. So we've tried to kind of like hone in and really keep our we uh have like certain kind of events that are regular their expected and kind of the team the team kind of knows that they're they're coming um versus having a bunch of kind of random stuff or like a lot of things off site and what we've seen work really well as our company grows is our individual teams will go out for dinners or for small. We've got reduced we've done some really interesting kind of offsides for smaller teams, but I think you know like going on doing bowling as an entire company is awesome and fun, but it's not necessarily something that's going to be engaging or really kind of excite people beyond oh that was a fun bowling night, but I think really just working to define what works best is the entire company versus what works best for smaller teams has been been one learning that we've definitely um taken on.
Kate: Yeah, interesting. How often do you so kind of going back to the success of the events? how How often do you gather new ideas? Like do start things regularly with the intent of them come becoming a tradition? Is that more often than not for you guys happen um organically? How um how do you how do they how do you shape these events that become beloved by so many over time?
Catie: Yeah, a lot of things have happened organically um early on I met with well early on I met with a lot of other people in a similar role that I'm in obviously, you know, we're a start-up where VC funded. So we are part of this larger portfolio companies and so I was really lucky early on to be connected to a lot of other office managers or culture managers and really I've just kind of developed ideas from things that they've done and cater them to our team. So early on I was implementing a lot of different things and kind of throwing things at the wall and seeing what sticks seeing what doesn't then another tradition that we have that really did develop organically. It was originally called cork. It's not called on courts, but essentially it started as um I don't know if you're familiar with the OKR system for tracking. So we implemented okay ours. And so part of that is kind of being able to uh check in as a team as to kind of where each team is tracking where he's tracking chat about what's working. What's not so we started this kind of um monthly happy hour, OKR review and in that we decided to build in um kind of an opportunity to recognize anniversaries. And so the way that we recognize anniversaries is we give employees this cube. We called them. They're cut their Cadre versary uh cubes their Cadre anniversary cube each year that you're here. You get a different color. So you've got year one year two Etc. um And so this was just kind of a side note of this on court was um managers would recognize their direct reports anniversary say if you were give them the cube. We ended up the the OKR portion of that of that kind of like monthly meeting ended up fizzling out just because people uh were talking and uh didn't really have any substance but the anniversary porch portion people love so I think managers really feel a lot of pride when their direct reports have had a successful year um and then they they can really kind of shine their achievements and then obviously direct reports love hearing that they've had a successful year, but I think something that's been really special is new employees being able to see that interaction on a company wide platform uh thing really gives them something to strive for and you know, like you really see you I look around the room because I'm using spinning towards the front and the coordinating. Handing things over out and keeping the show running but I can see the entire company just beaming up really they look so uh they just look like their hearts are being warmed which is uh really nice. So that's yeah that's example of a tradition that kind of like came out of nowhere ended up um evolving and then now is um when it's something that I think really I'm like the entire company appreciates that it's something that we do, and it's fun because we basically have these totem totems have these um on their So we've got a couple 5-year people. So you walk in if you walk around the office you can kind of see you know, like oh you can know from this physical thing like how long someone has been uh at the company.
Kate: That's so fun. And I love envisioning these OKR meetings as something that became kind of unintentionally more heart-centered. Yeah, like I love I love the idea and I know that OKRs are a really useful system and they bring a lot of success to companies and they might still be awesome for you guys, but the fact yeah, we're certain of that meeting fizzled out in and then in its place kind of went this heartwarming. Yeah, then turned meeting that I love the idea of that and it just so that that yeah the people want vulnerability and they uh they want the feelings part of it to shine.
Catie: Absolutely. And yes, OKRs are definitely still something very important. They now they live on a company-wide chair. Google sheet so they're accessible people can always go and check on them. We have um we still do have like a quarterly recap to go through all of the important things but that's done more than Monday morning all hand setting versus The Prime Time Thursday. Let’s all get together and have some fun spot.
Kate: Yeah. um I love that. Yeah. So taking one last little pivot on one of our previous calls, you told me that you sort of introduce your whole office to Rent the Runway, which I thought was so fun um and really speaks to your personality and the personality of the other women in your office. How has that shaped sort of a community for the other women in your office and have you been able to build any sort of tradition around this Rent the Runway thing? Yeah.
Catie: Yeah. So I think um this question started by is there something that everyone in the office you for and I was racking my brains and like what everyone knows I feed them. I make sure that there's you know fun surprises now and then I'm like there's a lot of things that I'm known for him. I'm always like running around during the stressful times and during the crazy times doing a million things and like well besides beating and looking frantic sometimes the renter Hundley thing really stood out. I've been I've been doing the Rent the Runway unlimited program since April of 2016, I believe. And so that's so the unlimited program basically you have four items at a time at any given time and they're delivered. I get them delivered to my office and they're delivering um these navy blue bags. So multiple times a week for a while. I was just me. I'm like these blue bags just keep getting delivered to me. Like, I wonder what everyone knows what this is. So I and I always I'm always like wearing some random like printed dress or something that you wouldn't necessarily wear to work. I'm like, well, I've got it I may as well wear it so I think I definitely was I definitely have talked about it a lot because it's something that I personally am obsessed with it's changed my entire wardrobe and ability to wear fine clothes. And then I think some of the other women were like this actually sounds like a really good idea. So over time I've probably a third to a half of the women here at Cadre are uh now all doing the rent the runway and limited as well. And so uh we do kind of have this little micro community of like, you know, everyone like people know, the other run through a might people are uh it's uh like hey, and he rented anything cute lately or I really like your dress like who makes that going to add it my hearts list. It's just kind of this. It's just a fun little it's a fun little part of the day or you can again take your brain uh out of the traditional like let's talk about spreadsheets or let's talk about this budget or everything like let's talk about this really fun floral dress that I got for my vacation in Mexico. And yeah it just again, it's just a fun little thing that I guess the women in the office can can use together as a bonding experience.
Kate: Yeah. Well read the runway if you're listening sponsored. Yeah.
Catie: Oh I met her I'd try to all the time um Ambassador farm at some point for sure. uh
Kate: Definitely uh influence her status over here. Yeah. Okay. So if there's anything else that you want to add as far as building traditions building culture from the ground up. Let us let us hear it.
Catie: I think one thing that's been really nice for my team for the broader team is we have a lot of micro communities. So, you know, obviously just mentioned about rent the runway but we have a group of people that consistently for the entire five years or so that I've been here that they love to play board games. I know that that's not something that's totally out of left field, um but they're consistently, you know uht hey say late order food. They'll sit in the kitchen and they'll pay for games and that has like continued on and on and on and I think it's nice that they empower themselves to do that. I mean, we've got a group that loves to go do karaoke. We've had we've got people that love to go rock climbing together. So I think really just encouraging employees to chat about their hobbies their interests, encourage, you know, encourage people to enjoy time together outside of the office. And you know, we what we've done in the past is where I've noticed these kind of like special interest groups. I have organized outings over time to get kind of a broader group out in that setting and give people that may not have had a chance to go rock climbing an opportunity to do so and then they may end up loving and then they're kind of uh like continuing to build uh these like smaller fractions. And I think another thing that we have kind of on that same note is we do have a we have a very open kitchen with snacks and you know, we'll have me we don't catered lunch that often but we always have something going on in there. So people from different teams will over here kind these these chatters these conversations. So I think it's uh kind of a snowball effect of getting getting employees interacting and talking about things that are they're passionate outside of work and then encouraging them to kind of go and do that together.
Kate: Yeah. That's so fun. I had a I had a group of people at my last company who did the board game thing to and I always say yeah funny. Yeah at fostering and you know enabling people to keep that hobby into light that fire and uh to know that they can do that at work too if they want and they have a group of uh people that yeah that they can enjoy that with it work not just kind of helps bridge the gap between personal and work life, um which is obviously as uh you know, so important. So rapid-fire perks. What are some of your favorite Perks at Cadre and if you had to choose one of them to have Forever and ever what would it be and why?
Catie: So favorite perks. I mean, we've got an awesome snack selection. We've always worked to make sure that we offer, you know, healthy snacks, which uh I was curating for some time. So it was always hard boiled eggs and avocados in addition to the uh other things that people enjoy, you know chips and cookies, but I think I like I said uh having a really stocked kitchen for snacks encourages people to go in there mix mingle and I like to do snacks and aren't necessarily grab and go. That way that you're kind of like you kind of like have to stay in the kitchen for a few minutes and that gives you the opportunity to maybe cross paths. We have a thing. I know you mentioned grabbing a coffee with with a co-worker but we actually have a formalized program called Cadre companions. So tenured people and new people they can opt into being matched matched with I guess tender people can opt into being into this program and uh new people when they're joining will be matched with a tenured person and you'll have several, quote unquote, coffee dates or walk and talks um scheduled for the first couple of months that they're here. And it's meant to be someone that's not on your direct team. So maybe someone that you may not be given direct exposure to right off the bat and they have a budget for this. So I think that's an awesome thing that we offer. I had to choose just one. I'm going to be selfish and it's we have a hundred percent of our health care paid for which is such a perk and I think it's something that I take four. Event and I take I take I like forget that I used have to pay for healthcare. And then I hear people like my boyfriend's paying, you know, x amount of dollars per paycheck and I forget that that's uh such an amazing thing that we offer here. um So I would choose that.
Kate: Yeah, we have the same thing as Zestful and yeah say yeah, sometimes every once in a while you'll you'll kind of forget. Yeah, and then you'll hear about someone else's health care experience and your like oh my God, I don't have to deal with that. That is I'm so grateful.
Catie: Exactly. So that's when I love ya.
Kate: Love it. Alright, last one. What is your ultimate dream perk? So sky's the limit. Would you have puppies in the office everyday? Would you have nap pods? Would you have a sous chef?
Catie: So I thought about this one. I love puppies. I would love to have them but we actually we allowed we allow dogs once you know, it's not we're not uh an office that has dogs all the time, but dogs are in the office sometime. So that one's already checked off. Nap pods. We have a uh lot of comfy couches. So if anyone ever really needs an app that's already taken care of. uh So, I'm really reaching for the sky. I would say an all-encompassing health and wellness uh center and in this Health and Wellness Center, I would love you know uh gym, but I'd really love like a personal Pilates trainer. I thought about this a lot, you know, but like any Pilates trainer and now you know with all of this. Enabled Fitness stuff. There's the Peloton uh there's the mirror. So maybe you don't even need a person make just take a robot. And then I don't know like a manicurist would be really nice. So, I'm uh really sorry. I’m always sitting on my desk like, oh, I really need a manicure but I don't want to go get one or sometimes quietly painting my nails like at my desk hoping no one comes over and ask what I'm doing. So I just had a destination in the office to get them done. That would be my dream.
Kate: Hmm. Well, you know as the person in charge charge of those things. I'm just saying you could bring this down into the budget.
Catie: I'm just blanketed health and wellness expensive every year just um put them in a courtroom and just say that it's booked all the time manicures get expensive. So now there with ya I do ya uh think what's uh awesome about being in a start-up is a lot of leaders in these companies realize the importance of having perks and of offering a workplace environment that is less traditional. More kind of like let's think outside the box um and let's keep our employees how happy and engaged but as a growing startup, I think opportunities to continue to expand the perk offering and also like I said learning what your employees want, you know, like kind of iterating as you go it's fun and it's it's a good way to get people involved by really kind of tapping them to say like what would make you happy this year? So we're actually working on a on a survey. So maybe we'll be switching up what we're offering soon.
Kate: Yeah, well, you're speaking our language that's certainly everything that Zestful stands for and why we're around and it's always really nice to hear from people like you who who get it. um Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing all of this with me today. It's been so fun to hear from you and to hear your thoughts and now I have a ton of ideas.
Catie: So oh good. I'm glad and love talking about what we've done here at Cadre uh and really excited to continue to do uh amazing things for the team.
Kate: Yay. Well, I love to hear that and if our listeners were to reach out to you if they have questions or just want to stay connected. How can they do that?
Catie: So you can learn more about quad ride by visiting Cadre dot com backslash careers, um which has our job openings and a little bit more about our teams and kind uh who we are. We are um also on LinkedIn by searching Cadre re we on Instagram handle is uh uh Cadre insights and then I can be reached on any of the three or um via email, my name is Catie with a see so, it's C A T I E and then my last thing is cased C A S E. Awesome.
Kate: Thank you Catie.
Catie: Thank you
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